Boruch S., a 20-year-old Chabad bochur in Crown Heights, has been thinking a lot lately about his financial future.
He makes $11.50 an hour working for a company that sells cell phones online, and lives in a basement with 3 roommates, each paying $350 a month toward rent. For now, he’s managing to pay his bills and avoid credit card debt, but knows that he would not be able to support a family with his current income.
While learning in Yeshiva, Boruch lived in a sheltered environment, but reality hit hard when he faced the challenge of having to earn a living after concluding his learning in Yeshiva.
“My first year after Yeshiva was challenging; I had no idea how to go about finding a job or managing my finances,” he said about living on his own with bills have to be paid and money always needed there never seems for essentials (food, toiletries and MetroCards).
But his situation is far from unique. Many young men and women find themselves without financial direction or resources after completing the frum educational system and face rising real estate prices and low salaries, if they even get hired.
“On one hand, we are told to not go to college, but that leaves us with no way to support ourselves afterward,” says Devora L. who lives at home and works as a program director for a Chabad center in Long Island.
“I love the shlichus work I am doing now, but with this job, I have not been able to save any money. I need to start thinking about my future,” she says.
COLLEGE = SOLUTION?
While college prepares about 70% of American teenagers for the workforce, it is not an option for many Crown Heights residents, for ideological and practical reasons.
“My parents aren’t willing to pay for college, and I can’t afford to pay for it myself,” says Sarale G., who has to babysit in the evenings to supplement her income working as a secretary by day.
Instead, she was referred by a friend to the Geshem Center, a career training academy in Crown Heights, now located at 391 Kingston Avenue, between Montgomery Street and Crown Street. Its large space holds multiple classes and future plans include a resource room for individual and collaborative work-study.
“We can’t expect our high schools and Yeshivas to churn out work-ready individuals,” says Rabbi Levi Kaplan, Geshem’s Director of Operations. “Specialized skills take time to master, and vocational training requires expensive equipment and expert instructors – resources that our cash-strapped institutions cannot realistically provide.”
Sarale said the affordable price of $350 for a 6-week course motivated her to begin. Thankfully, her investment paid off. After taking a QuickBooks class, she was able to take on more responsibilities at work. “The Shliach increased my hours because I started doing all the bookkeeping,” she says.
NEW AVENUE
Finding a job can be a daunting task for Yeshiva and high school graduates. Parents are finding it harder than ever to support their families, and the pressure trickles down to the young adults.
So in addition to its job-skills training courses, the Geshem Center recently launched its new career development center to help prepare residents of the Crown Heights community for the “real world.”
Boruch S., the single bochur, found Geshem through Facebook and decided to start off with basic computer programming courses. “It’s something I was always interested in,” he says.
According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the average salary of a computer programmer is about $35 to $50 an hour, depending on the individual’s talent and experience.
“It’s a great job for someone like me who wants to work and be home for his kids,” he points out. “I can work flexible hours and do programming from any computer. I would definitely recommend Geshem’s course to anyone with any interest in computers or programming.”
The Rohr Jewish Learning Institute (JLI), the provider of adult Jewish learning around the world, has turned to Geshem when searching for positions to fill at its head office in Crown Heights.
“It’s invaluable for our organization to have access to talented, employable Lubavitch individuals,” says JLI’s COO Dubi Rabinowitz.
To sign up for the summer semester, meet with a career advisor, or explore new professional opportunities, visit www.GeshemCenter.com.
FACT: College educated individuals have higher average salaries than those without a college education. FACT: In the recent recession, the percentage of college grads who became unemployed was significantly lower than the percentage of those without a degree. FACT: It is getting harder and harder to find good paying jobs, and employers are now using college degrees as an absolute starting point. In other words, jobs that did not need degrees 10 years ago do now simply to stick out from the crowd. FACT: Those without college degrees are significantly more dependent on welfare and assistance programs. FACT: Statistically, once… Read more »
According to the sichos, the problem with college is not necessarily the content, but the atmosphere. So if it’s in a Jewish environment, with Jewish students and Jewish instructors, and they don’t teach outright apikorsus, then why not?
i agree- the long short way pays off!!! Touro is the best
Who gave u this letter of 7 conditions?
Where can I see it?
I just asked arround, no one seems to know what ur referring to! Please (for the sake of the public) clarify
Thank you!
First he says that college is not ideal for all, but then he goes on to gives many reasons why one should go if they are in certain situations. I believe there were about 7, i wish i could find this letter to show you. i was given this letter when i started going bc i wanted to make sure and asked a rov. I do understand that a majority of chabad fall under “do not go” however some do. So please stop saying The rebbe said do not go, it is untruthful. up to Hashem is very touchy. I… Read more »
College is absolutely not an option for purposes of making a keli for parnasa
The rare exceptions were for BTs who’ve already began a degree, in some cases the Rebbe implored them to complete it, in Proffeaaor Get’s case (from MI) the Rebbe repeatedly urged him to continue and get his doctorate.
As for every sicha and igros from the Rebbe re College
The Rebbe is adamant, Hashem has a way to provide you with Parnasa with a vessel other than College
One needs only to make a disciplined effort al pi teva + btochoin, then it’s up to Hashem!!
Either way you twist it the Rebbe’s words against college and the reality of today cannot be reconciled.
ppl keep saying that the Rebbe said no! to schooling. in Fact he gave many reasons why it would be OK for some ppl. Please dont use him! But yea, school is not for evryone.
Aggressive national and international competition in every field, as well as overcapacity in many — preclude the pricing freedom necessary for capital-attracting profit margins.
Accordingly, on the other side of the ledger, cost containment becomes essential to maintain competitiveness: that means personnel!
We must face the fact that businesses have incentives not to hire workers in an effort to curtail costs in order to be competitive in growing markets overseas; for example, the Chinese have 300 million middle-class consumers (roughly, the population of the United States), and they have another billion potential customers coming along.
We must consult Yedidim Mevinim,
Make a full diciplined Hishtadlus al pi teva
and then Have B’Tochon!
Thats the way the Rebbe taught us.
The Rebbe was adamantly against, shtick, Hashem has a way to get you the parnasa you need in a kosher and acceptable chanel
That every time this subject comes up of parnassa in the real world (meaning when you dont have a rich / or shliach family member giving you a job) there are tons of comments. Here again, 70 comments in less than a day. We have a serious problem !!! Other chassidic groups support each other but in Chabad you are on your own. How are we supposed to have many kids, make simchas all the time one after the other, pay for chinuch, etc without a degree at least something in hand. Forget even about doing chesed and helping others.… Read more »
Actually, having gone through the Cope program, I can tell you that you DO walk away with a real degree that lets you become a CPA and earn a REAL parnassa. All this, while never stepping foot in a traditional college (all of their classes are given in their building in Boro Park). It works!
I see everyone boasting about the Geshem Center and COPE…why is that any better then going to an all men or women’s program at Touro College. At least you can come out with a real respectable degree that’s universally accepted.
To me it seems these other programs are for taking shortcuts – which aren’t really shortcuts. It’s the “short-long way”. People should go the “Long-Short way”
No offense, but your answer don’t make sense even at the first glance…. 1)so again, if the content of specific trade is allwed, what is the problem with going to a frum college like Touro?? me and many other Lubavitchers did it…and we are still frum…is the name “college” is the problem? 2)so their money is ok…as long as they give it to us…no matter the way it was earnd, it’s just about the money….isn’t that sends the wrong message to everyone that it’s ok to go college and become succesful..we will still honor you for your money…? 3) I… Read more »
Case in point, Eliyahu F has been trained as a lawyer, yet his older brother Ben, hired him for an eCommerce business he started with hard work and ingenuity, no college degree required!
without a college degree, Ben has made more money than college graduates typically do, his brother included
last i checked, Hashem runs the world, not some misguided liberal arts professor, whose group-think dictates that success can only come through years of college college debt and public brainwashing
if they dont follow the Rebbe, they are not his followers,
read #8, those who follow the Rebbe’s teachings, don’t end up in college.
way to go! on the mark
your questions have been answered
of people on government assistance? Anyone?
Bsd What are the statistics of college graduates that are: – happily married – have emotionally healthy children – have a meaningful and satisfying religious life – are satisfied with their financial status – are on shlichus (if this is an important value, it should be included as well) – are out of debt Simply comparing highest level of degree to income level across a society does not give a proper study of the basic values gained from college The rebbe’s guidance is not only a spiritual explanation re the channels of Brocho but direction towards Brocho in every aspect… Read more »
Those are good questions.
nature is in G-d’s hands, we need to respect nature only because G-d wants us not to violate it’s integrity.
(by preserving the integrity of nature as much as possible, allows for this plane to remain a “low world, for dira batchtonim purposes)
yet a chosid knows that parnasa does not really com from “nature” itself, only from hashem who requires us to receive his blessings via a natural vessel,
however, that natural vessel need not violate halacha or the Rebbe’s teachings
your questions are (at first glance) reasonable! you asked; 1. If all the content of college is treif,… why teach any of it? 2. If going to college is wrong, why fund-raise from those who went to college (honoring them at dinners)? 3. Didnt the Rebbe go to college…. The answer in brief at least 1. Trade specific training is kosher and even a mitzvah! (within a spiritually kosher environment) 2. fund-raising is ok from anybody, even from those who do somethings wrong. (I’ve been to dozens of dinners, not one honored a chabad-raised-rebellious college graduate, i agree an educational… Read more »
There is a reason why so many of our people go to college, and it’s very simple: the world has change, and so are the requirements of the job market. It is so sad to see so many married man and woman trying to go to college while working and rasing a family at the same time. These people discovered the sad reality that a college degree is a must requirement to land a decent job,and as a result, they and their families suffer from financial hardship and many missing hours from home just to get through. The system must,and… Read more »
The Rebbe is very clear, “If i send you to consult a “Yedid Mevin” then, the answer you’ll get from him is MY ANSWER TO YOU” The Rebbe’s Bracha and Haskama only comes via a “Aseh Lecha Rav” or “Yedid Mevin” if, and only if you follow the Rebbe’s guidelines re “Aseh Lecha Rav” etc 1. Yedid, He/She really cares and has compassion to help 2. Mevin, He/She really is an ex[pert in the area in question, by virtue of their own results and reputation for success in the area in question 3. Bayshan, He/She must be humble and honest,… Read more »
Thanks for the common sense, not so common to those who blindly advocate college, despite its growing reputation for being less and less relivant to one’s earning ability in today’s economy (nearly 50% with college degree, unemployed and debt over their head)
i know a lawyer who cant find a job as a lawyer
so his brother was nice to him and hired him! his brother started an e commerce business w/o relying on a college degree
Too many people dont really follow the system on its terms, They dont keep seder, They dont put in the time and effort to learn at their own (personal best) level. They dont go on miztzoyim, release-time etc at every opportunity seder allows They dont seek the guidance of experts (yedidim mevinim). They dont take care of their health (smoke/drink/overeat) They dont spend each summer investing all they’ve got to excel as educators and leaders the list goes on They dont follow (or even remember) all the takanos the Rebbe says is essential for material and spiritual success As post… Read more »
Faceebook, like TV, is bad as a “Consumer” and is very good as a “Tool” to reach others & disseminate the light of Torah!
To be a Mekabel of TV/FB etc, is surely against our teachings,
To be a Mashpia, utilizing TV/FB etc to broadcast the message out there, Thats good!!
I was waiting for someone to ask!
read #8
he/sh makes an excellent point “a flake is a flake is a flake” if your a mature, resourcesful man, you’ll do as many have after yeshiva, be proactive find a trade, work hard, and work your way up the later! yes w/o college! re-direct all that time, effort people spend on their college degrees, and apply it to investing in the area of your natural interests as an apprentice, if your dedicated and disciplined you’ll make it!
if your a flake, just blame everyone around you!
A BT can go to college,no problem
Dont get confuse.Rebbe’s advice not to go to college is for FFB
your points are very self evident, but thank you for articulating them, took the words out of my mouth!
Those who think they know better, how to attract a parnasa from Hashem, good for them, as a chossid of the Rebbe, i firmly believe, that if you follow his, system in life, not just lazily cherry-picking, but really seek to live the way the Rebbe requires a chossid to, then, you surely will see the Rebbe’s words fulfilled, So are all Orthodox really poorest? after reading post #8, i’ll venture to say, Yesh v Yesh! Let me explain, there are “ORTHODOX-styled” people, who dress the dress and are “stylistically” and culturally orthodox, at least on the surface. however, there… Read more »
$350 for a Quickbooks class (6 weeks is just basics, also) is alot of money. And I think the mention of Rohr asking for their graduates is a poorly veiled attempt to say that Geshem get people good jobs…Rohr jobs in CH are also “handout” positions. Even though, right now, 40% of graduates are not getting jobs, that’s because of the current economy, and the majors are “fluff (history, liberal arts, etc)
Our system is a failure at producing responsible and contributing members of society. The individuals who are stirring out of the herd’s groupthink are not doing so early enough, or in great enough numbers. Of commentator #8’s list of ‘skills’ gained from Yeshiva, only analytic thinking–as a prerequisite for critical thinking–helped me towards my passion: a science degree and the road to becoming a scientist. The rest of what he mentions will only make you a better worker if you’re in the “good bochur” category he mentioned… meaning college will do the very same for you ON TOP of the… Read more »
The kindle fire fights every word it does not recognize and substitutes something else in it’s stead. Can’t judge peoples’ spelling anymore since the computer and calculator age has ruined the youth in terms of their skills.
Thats right, facebook is a tool. Kinda like college… Hmm… So why not use college as a tool to: earn a living, give tzedaka, provide parnasa for your family, spread yiddishkeit, make a kiddush Hashem etc?
If the content of college is treif, why you open up such “secular studies center” in CH?? you can call it all you want, but “Geshem”is teaching the same things….. If college is so bad, why Lubavitch keep honoring (at the dinner)those who broke the system and went to college and become successful… No reason to run in circles, but the rebbe went to college…. And yes, if you graduate from Geshem, you might lend a job at JLI and finally be able to afford moving out of the basement…but to get a job that will support a family and… Read more »
so right!!!
Those advocating not going to college have what to stand on. Please don’t peddle brochos and guarantees, just work on your emuna a bit and have a little more bitochon. Don’t turn the Rebbe and G-d into your own personal ATM’s with fraudulent advice. All the statistics and employment studies show college grads on average earn much more than those without a degree and that’s fine. The Fr. Rebbe sent chasidim on missions that were their final shlichus. The Rebbe gave chasidim their shlichus that wasn’t all that rosy bigashmious. The richest of us all is the one happy with… Read more »
The facts are what they are: There is a perfect correlation between levels of education and income in the Jewish community. The greater number of college-educated members of a sub-group, the higher the per capita income. Stop denying reality. Ask yourself if Conservative, Reform, or Modern Orthodox Jews have nearly the concentration of poverty or welfare recipients as their less educated counterparts. They don’t. Sure there are exceptions for every norm, and there are some wealthy people with no formal education in the Ultra Orthodox / Chassidic ranks, but they make up a small minority. If you want to continue… Read more »
If someone can handle themselves in college, why not go. end of discussion. You need to raise your family. Hashem put us in a physical world. Yes, Hashem gives us all the parnasa that we need. But ONLY if we meet Him halfway. Getting smicha and getting a small part time job while the wife is at home not working because she has 10 kids, THAT is not meeting Him halfway. If you feel you are able to handle yourself in college without falling off derech, then go. Hey, its great shluchis practice, anyways. Better than being isolated in your… Read more »
Interestingly, most of the comments against college are written poorly and have multiple spelling mistakes.
#7, you took the words out of my mouth! Kudos!
If people have an ideological problem with college, great. No argument there. Say the Rebbe doesn’t want you to go to college. Good for you, for being strong. Hopefully you’ll be able to put food on the table. However, when individuals like #3 cherry pick random statistics to try to argue that college isn’t important, the argument is idiotic.
Very cute
I’m a full fledged Oholey Torah nik, the only skill I learned besides being a major Chutzpanik was how to pay Knosim! I don’t blame the system for anything, cause I’m old enough to take responsibility for myself, however going forward for future generators something has to be done, cause after my wedding the bills start piling in,and I took a job in retail where I make enough to pay my bills, however this is the kind of job you can’t raise a family on. I’m not saying every Bocher needs a college degree, however the guys are leaving Smicha… Read more »
I Like
I also heard about Cope Institute. Is that the program that’s been advertising on COL recently?
https://staging.collive.com/files/0.34015621562_777215.jpg
Kudos to Cope!! Same experience as #27
I couldn’t agree more with you. I went to Cope Institute a few years ago and now have a full parnassa as a CPA. The entire experience was in a totally chassideshe environment. It is a real kiddush hashem! In my class there were at least 5 other Lubavitchers and the rest were from Williamsburg and BP.
to 17, YES YES YES! only those who follow the Rebbe’s horoaos, get to rely on his brochos!
#23
Faceebook, like TV, is bad as a “consumer” and very good as a “tool” to reach others & disseminate the light of Torah!
to be a Mekabel of TV/FB etc is surely against our teachings,
to be a Mashpia, utilizing TV/FB etc to broadcast the message out there, Thats good!!
after reading post #8, i’ll venture to say this, that there are “orthodox-styled” people, who dress the dress and “stylistically” live in the orthodox culture. there is a massive distinction between the many who call themselves orthodox, chabad, chasidic etc vs those who REALLY live, its ideals, demands and teachings! what percentage of poor people do you see Davening vosikin, b’minyin in 770 bright and early? i guarantee you that there is a clear coloration between the late daveners and their socio-economic functionality! in other words, its not intellectually honest to lump ALL “chasidic dressed” people together as portreying AUTHENTIC… Read more »
So facebook is okay but college is bad???
I meant #17 not 7
just google this quote:
“Recent U.S. college graduates disillusioned, more than 40% unemployed: poll
i know personally many examples that back up your observation
#8 made some very valid points
#7 do you really need to be so sarcastic????
What published facts? You are either an idiot or blind. There is not one study that claims that non college grads make more than college grads. In fact the poorest Jewish communities in America are the Ultra-Orthodox ones.
So only those who follow the Rebbe’s horoaos, get to rely on his brochos?
There are B”H many frum institutions today in our neighborhood that help frum buchrim and yungerleit gain marketable skills in an extremely kosher way.
Some, like COPE Institute, in Brooklyn (-under Agudas Yisroel-) actually help from people get a perfectly respectable bachelor degree in accounting without needing to ever step foot in a college!
Frankly, the Geshem Center should be focusing more on full degrees than on small, short courses. Unfortunately, these days you can’t feed your family doing entry level bookkeeping…
to those who think you know better than the Rebbe
if the Rebbe said your kli for parnasa does not include college, than trust him
2. “VAST KNOWLEDGE” & “ANALYTICAL SKILLS”
chasidim know that the Rebbe knows, even when your own secular sechel contradicts the Rebbe’s view
Finally, someone is doing something about the lack of direction for our bochurim…Please don’t knock it until you’ve been there.
I wish this new online program much hazlacha and hope others will follow suit.
This is a case of not throwing out the baby with the bathwater.
YES college is bad. NO.. learning is not bad. This solves both cases. Case closed!
Mr Ginsberg, sponsored by fegs, is asigned exclusively to Crown heights residents, with the consent of the community council, to help many of our men (not just discover what their innate talents and interests are but also) believe that college is an acceptable route.
he ought to either respect our values and our Rebbe (and work within those parameters) or recuise himself from this community
When you have people in higher power and corporations only invested in themselves to make profits what do you expect?
You think the economy will be like this forever. Those who are better educated will reap better rewards.
What if someone wants to become a doctor, or a lawyer or an architect, all very important parts of a community. should they not go to college and become a computer programmer or bookkeeper instead? This is a great idea for people who don’t yet know what they want to do, and want to make money with an easy investment. but it NO way is this a perminant answer.
I do not want to live in a community where no one went to college and everybody knows how to program.
there are two general groups of bochurim who go through the “system” Group 1) those bochurim who dress the dress, but dont really follow the system on its term… Group 2) Takes each part of the system seriously, and as a result has developed and accumulated many enriching qualities, yedios, skills and habits. that are all enhancing, and transferable in real (career) life… Just to list a few examples of how the system’s demands of a bochur, (if followed) enriches those bochurim who took it seriously: 1. “TIME MANAGEMENT SKILLS” Seder, Punctuality, Self discipline, the habit of shmiras hasdorim develops… Read more »
Stop playing with statistics to make it fit your world view. Every statistic has shown that college graduates on average make a lot more then non graduates. A person with a masters on average makes $50,000 more a year then one without an education. Btw, many college graduates went for degrees that are not high paying–liberal arts degrees that include History, Political Science, and Philosophy.
My siblings and I have all gone through the yeshiva system and half of us are doctors today….There is no excuse, no one to blame. If you want something, then you can make it happen.
Stay at his job selling things online where he will learn lots of skills, and hopefully start his own business….
how many sichos the Rebbe relayed the dangers of going to college.
it is a sakono nafshis, and facts prove, that doesnt help much either
“Recent U.S. college graduates disillusioned, more than 40% unemployed: poll
“Today’s students graduate from college with heavy debts, and many aren’t reaping the benefits of that education — a poll shows recent grads often find jobs that don’t require a college degree. More than 40% are unemployed, and 16% are in part-time positions.”
Its yet more proof, that Parnasa comes from Hashem, we need only to find a (kosher) kli al pi teva
In today’s new economic landscape, to get hired, what matters more than the college degree, is specific training, skills, work ethic, reputation of being a dedicated, reliable, hard-worker!
“The Shliach increased my hours because I started doing all the bookkeeping,” she says.” Did the bookkeeper get laid off? Not being sarcastic . . . this is the job market. I’ve had many jobs . . . ‘out of business’ ‘laid off’ ‘last to come, first to go,’ etc. Interesting article. A BIG problem in America is medical insurance. If you earn too much you may not qualify for ‘Medicaid’ and pvt. insurance is expensive. “A government of the rich by the rich and for the rich, will not perish from the earth!” (Perhaps ‘Obamacare’ has improved the miserable… Read more »